A list of online services to regain control over your privacy online

[Aristarchus]

I believe that both of those companies have zero-knowledge encryption configured. They will, of course, be able to tell the IP addresses - if they log them - but they don't have your password and thus can not decrypt the contents of your inbox.

If they logged it, they could also do things like see who you sent emails to, 'cause the address kind of has to be in plain text.

I can't speak to what they log.

Proton Email provided police with user's recovery email and in effect police had full access to user's all email.
For totally lazy

ProtonMail hands info to government but says it’s not Google

ProtonMail handed user information to Spanish authorities, leading privacy advocates to claim it violated its promise to protect user data.

protos.com

Proton Mail Discloses User Data Leading to Arrest in Spain

Proton Mail came under scrutiny for its role in a legal request by the Spanish authorities leading to the identification and arrest of a user.

cyberinsider.com

User made it possible to decrypt data and this led to the arrest:
"The core of the controversy stems from Proton Mail providing the Spanish police with the recovery email address associated with the Proton Mail account of an individual using the pseudonym ‘Xuxo Rondinaire.’ This individual is suspected of being a member of the Mossos d’Esquadra (Catalonia’s police force) and of using their internal knowledge to assist the Democratic Tsunami movement."

User was at fault not Proton but expectations regarding Swiss law are ridiculous.

The only example I know where owner rather shut down business than provide data is lava mail (this happened in US).
However expecting that business owner will go to the extreme are not reasonable.

 

[Terminal Velocity]

Recovery email is optional in the settings of Protonmail and guess what... Protonmail must have this info unencrypted and available in order to recover your account if needed. All the info about that guy they gather it from Apple services not from Protonmail. Protonmail once again disclose nothing. But if the court demands it they have to give what they have and that's fine in my use case

 

[Tomedi]

Protonmail once again disclose nothing. But if the court demands it they have to give what they have and that's fine in my use case

Tuta, once again, discloses nothing. But it the court demands it, they have to give what they have and that's should be fine in your case, so what are you ranting about?

 

[hacktheworld]

I honestly don't trust Proton very much, given the past precedents, I also add that I don't trust anyone at all.

ProtonMail Gives Up Logs on User, Then Scrubs Website of No IP Logging Claims

ProtonMail has been caught logging a user that was the target of an investigation. After getting caught, ProtonMail changed its website.

cyberinsider.com

 

[Terminal Velocity]

The whole point is that anyone interested for user data they must go through the route of the Swiss court, no illegal data handling is permitted in Switzerland, and Swiss laws protect all people not only Swiss citizens because they apply to the data not to individuals

 

[Tomedi]

... no illegal data handling is permitted in Switzerland...

Name me one European country where illegal data handling is permitted. And wouldn't permitting something illegal make it... legal?

Where you're in a hole, stop digging.

BTW Swiss constitution (Article 13 in this case) applies to Swiss citizens only.

Back to the topic. Which messangers do you guys use? It's WhatsApp for me. I've failed to convince anyone to move to something else, but, to be honest, I believe that WhatsApp is secure enough.

 

[Terminal Velocity]

Name me one European country where illegal data handling is permitted. And wouldn't permitting something illegal make it... legal?

Where you're in a hole, stop digging.

BTW Swiss constitution (Article 13 in this case) applies to Swiss citizens only.

Back to the topic. Which messangers do you guys use? It's WhatsApp for me. I've failed to convince anyone to move to something else, but, to be honest, I believe that WhatsApp is secure enough.

If you think there is no illegal handling of data in the whole world you are probably living in a hole. Anyone interested search about a guy named Snowden. This is the last post that I address to you, do not quote me again

 

[Brickwizard]

Which messangers do you guys use?

I have FB, but do not directly use it. as i only need FB messenger to contact a few people so I access it using Caprine [Linux front end app] and I have a whatsapp account use just to keep in contact with granddaughter this is accessed from my main computer desktop using the Linux whatsapp desktop, I opened an X account just to contact one supplier who do not have any internet contact or e-mail, then closed it after sending 2 messages the second telling them to put my account where the sun doesn't shine

 

[Tomedi]

@Terminal Velocity

There is no law in the entire universe that can stop illigal activity. Illegal activity by definition takes place outside of the law. Any law. American, European or... Swiss. If there was illegal handling of data in Switzerland, you wouldn't know about it. And if, at the same time, there was no Swiss Snowden, the world would never learn about it. So, can you be 100% sure the illegal handling of data doesn't take place in Switzerland right now? No, you can't. So, stop digging. The next step is a total paranoia.

@Terminal Velocity

Unfortunately, it's not up to you what and who do I quote. Throwing toys out of the pram is not gonna change that.

EDIT Improved formatting

 

[Fanboi]

Recovery email is optional in the settings of Protonmail

It's not completely optional. Try and sign up for FB or Twitter or whatever with an anon Protonmail account. It'll block the authentication mail an spew a whole load of garbage about wanting to prevent abuse and getting their domain blocked... Basically they don't want you to use Protonmail as a way to circumvent social media verifying you... But they are an enterprise, and they have every right not to wind up in the "we don't accept email verification from <insert provider> bin" on social media. As I said, it's their service, their rules.

I should probably mention that if you want some anonymity, there are tons of domain + email-only packages out there that will cost you between $25 - $45 USD a year. And many don't care who you are. Some may want a phone number but you can buy pre-registered SIMs from the local Nigerian cigarette shop down the road (speaking from experience*) and you can use a prepaid credit card to pay... Ya know, if you're running from Interpol because you assassinated a president or something.
So there's

There's still GMX, which lets you create alias addresses that you can burn. Of course this is mainly for creating burner accounts that don't ask for phone validation.


* Indemnification: I'm not promoting circumventing RICA to any South Africans here (none I know of). My ID and phone were in the same pouch so lost both at once. It takes 6-8 weeks to get a replacement ID here in SA unless you fork out an additional R140 (140 ZAR) for a temp ID (a bold money racket if ever there was), and I needed a phone to use my banking app and receive updates on when to collect my ID (yes, note the chicken-egg: I had to actually provide them a contact number) from DHA. FWIW, I got a new SIM and that was RICA'd simply because I have no idea what the pre-registered one was tied to. Could've been an international assassin, lol.

 

[data_x33]

Back to the topic. Which messangers do you guys use? It's WhatsApp for me. I've failed to convince anyone to move to something else, but, to be honest, I believe that WhatsApp is secure enough.

I use WhatsApp. I don’t know anyone who wants to switch to something else either.

 

[tinfoil-hat]

I use WhatsApp. I don’t know anyone who wants to switch to something else either.

For me it's simplex

SimpleX Chat: private and secure messenger without any user IDs (not even random)

SimpleX Chat - a private and encrypted messenger without any user IDs (not even random ones)! Make a private connection via link / QR code to send messages and make calls.

simplex.chat

Matrix

Element | Secure collaboration and messaging

Element is a Matrix-based end-to-end encrypted messenger and secure collaboration app. It’s decentralised for digital sovereign self-hosting, or through a hosting service such as Element Matrix Services. Element operates on the open Matrix network to provide interoperability and easy connections.

element.io

Tox:

qTox: A New Kind of Instant Messaging

With the rise of government monitoring programs, qTox provides an easy to use application that allows you to connect with friends and family without anyone else listening in. While other big-name services require you to pay for features, qTox is totally free, and comes without advertising.

qtox.github.io

and IRC

 

[tinfoil-hat]

For Privacy there also Darknets, which are censor resistant and privacy fokused

There are also several Darknets:
TOR (i recommend Whonix):

Whonix - Superior Internet Privacy

Whonix can anonymize everything you do online! It runs like an App, is a Free, Open Source and Kicksecure™ hardened Linux distribution.

www.whonix.org

Zeronet:

ZeroNet: Decentralized websites using Bitcoin cryptography and the BitTorrent network

Hyphanet:

Hyphanet

i2p+:

I2P Anonymous Network

Anonymous peer-to-peer distributed communication layer built with open source tools and designed to run any traditional Internet service such as email, IRC or web hosting.

geti2p.net

BE CAREFUL: Those are unmoderated and certainly include some shady / harmful stuff

The best way to use these is in a VM like Whonix or Kicksecure:

Kicksecure - Secure by Default Operating System

A secure by default operating system with the latest security research in place.

www.kicksecure.com

 

[KGIII]

Proton Email provided police with user's recovery email

Yup. I believe I mentioned that (recovery email) in another comment. You need REALLY good OpSec if you want any chance to avoid prosecution. Not even Tor is absolute, especially if you're using it to access the regular internet.

 

[data_x33]

For me it's simplex ..

The only truly private and secure way to have a conversation is to meet up in the park. No phones allowed!!!

 

[hacktheworld]

Regarding instant messaging apps, Whatsapp is certainly not among the safest also because it collects log data and other data, even Telegram is not encrypted by default for end to end chats, Signal appears safer than other apps in any case for these apps you have to provide the phone number.
Any suggestions about it?

 

[Tomedi]

If you don't want to provide the phone number or email then Session looks like a good option. I've tried it. It works quite well, but good luck with making your family and friends to use it...

 

[hacktheworld]

but good luck with making your family and friends to use it...

Very true

 

[Aristarchus]

Yup. I believe I mentioned that (recovery email) in another comment. You need REALLY good OpSec if you want any chance to avoid prosecution. Not even Tor is absolute, especially if you're using it to access the regular internet.

Yes, this is exactly my point. Even if we assume that all internet providers are honest this is not enough to be anonymous and/or private. If user does not follow basic rules then no "Swiss" law will help.

Basically user is only responsible party that keeps all information private.

 

[Aristarchus]

If you don't want to provide the phone number or email then Session looks like a good option. I've tried it. It works quite well, but good luck with making your family and friends to use it...

Yes, I use Session and it is very nice but following the spirit of compartmentalization, I use Briar and Cwtch also.